(Update: 12/23/07)
Upon further analysis, it appears the NBC4 live feed (see 2nd half) that aired on 9/11 minute(s) before the 2nd hit did not originate from the TinaCart1 building, the place were three "amateur" shots of the WTC crashes emerged.
The shot appears to have originated higher and to the right of the TinaCart1 building at 475 Kent Ave, Brooklyn. My best guess as of now is that the NBC4 shot may have originated on top of the Gretsch building.
This shot has a lot of mystery to it that may yet still yield a smoking gun. As far as I can tell, this shot only aired once and it was airing live right before the 2nd WTC crash which means it should have captured the 2nd hit. Were was this shot located? Was it from a network camera, or a non-network camera atop some building that the network tapped into?
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Another interesting thing about this NBC4 clip, is who is being interviewed during this "live" shot that appears to have only been aired once on TV. The person being interview is some older-sounding man with a weird NY accent named "Tony Arrigo" who claims to have witnessed the first crash.
Arrigo's alleged location: 31 E 12th St, NYCThis "Tony" sounds just a tad suspicious because he sounds a little too over-emotional on the phone compared almost all other WTC witnesses being phone interviewed live and, coincidentally, describes the first plane as a Boeing 737 which is the same exact plane described by another rare and suspicious 1st plane eyewitness, CNN VP Sean Murtagh (also @4:38).
---------------------------------
(Update 11/08/08: Questions about Gary Welz moved here.)
37 comments:
A slam dunk, my friend. The camera was obviously in place and trained on the towers all morning. The NBC affiliate probably just got told by someone higher up to broadcast a live feed, and they just slap their banner on it. Most people at the station would have no idea whose feed it was, much less how long the camera had been in place. I'm sure they were just happy to air anything they could get their hands on at the time. I just don't understand why people can't look at this OBVIOUS EVIDENCE OF TV FAKERY AND FOREKNOWLEDGE and see what you and I see so plainly. Keep up the great work and, of course, the critical thinking!
Ok.. here are my thoughts on this:
First off, you can clearly tell that the NBC4 picture is different than the other one you compared it too. The smoke is different. Look at it closely. They are clearly different times. And if it was TV fakery.. why does it matter? What does it change? Also.. explain the plane parts found? I don't see how it matters that there were no planes. And what about the millions of people in NY and NJ that saw the planes?.. are they all liars and paid off? From what I've read, this theory has very little credibility and just complicates things more and makes the movement look even more crazier to the brain-dead public. We NEED to push FACTS. Leave out theories. Give the people FACTS. Peace.
Brayman, the colors are different even among the 3 different TinaCart1 video versions! That is just simple color tweaking during the video editing process. YES, they ARE at different times. Did you not read the article? The live feed was airing BEFORE the second hit as shown on the TinaCart1 shot.
Obviously you don't read very well, because my post was not about no-planes, but about TV fakery and prior knowledge.
As for facts, what part of the perps had a LIVE FEED at an "amateur" house airing before the 2nd hit do you not understand?
Killtown.....GREAT work. Thanks for this great work and information you put out there.
I do, however, think you should not even bother debating a post like Brayman's. As, you pointed out, The Brayman's of this world apparently do not comprehend the written word too well.
Also....."Millions of people in NY and NJ that saw the planes"... A comment like that speaks volumes of it's writer.
Thanks again KT..please know there are many, many of us that value the contributions you make and continue to make..Unlike a few frauds on the CNN trail...but alas that is another story!
No need for an attitude. It was my mistake. Honestly, I didn't read the whole article and I was just going off of what I've heard before. My mistake.
It's pretty interesting actually. Don't know if I'm completely convinced or not, but its good to question these things.
I just saw the first pics and I thought you were saying that the planes were faked because one pic showed a plane and the other did. I should've read it before I said anything and made myself look like an uneducated asshole lol.
Keep up the good work.
Peace
NewNightX03, thanks for you compliments!
Brayman, thanks for owning up. That speaks volumes in my book (the good kind). You don't have to believe in no-planes/TV fakery for this smoking gun find to apply to you. Assume all the videos/photos are real. The networks were running a LIVE FEED at this amateur house before the 2nd hit. HOW DID THEY GET THERE SO FAST??? It's clear they were there in anticipation for what was about to happen which proves foreknowledge.
So regardless at to whether the videos are real or fake, they had a live feed going at that house and that proves prior knowledge.
Peace out.
I do apologize if I was overy critical of you Brayman. I don't even usually reply to postings, I usually just soak up all the info I can and leave my opinion out. The thing you said that triggered me was
"From what I've read, this theory has very little credibility and just complicates things more and makes the movement look even more crazier to the brain-dead public".
This got me because it sums up the entire problem with the "brain-dead public" you speak of. I too was a bit skeptical at first, in part from "(W)hat I've read" Thankfully I took the time to really further my own research and find the truth. I wish other would do so as well. It seems quite clear to me that the people/entities that claim "this theory has very little credibility" have quite an odor emanating from them. A very suspicious odor.
All I can say is KT has proved his credibility to my satisfaction, and I will look forward to more of his contributions to the REAL truth of 9-11-01. I'd much rather sit with KT then sit with people/entities that SIT WITH CNN.
Peace to you..
Thanks for being cool about it. It was just a late night for me last nite so I didn't really read any of it lol. But now that I've read it.. I see what you mean. It's kind of suspicious.
And mainly when I was typing about 'little credibility'.. I was talking about the 'no planes'.. honestly I can't say that I've researched it a lot, but I've heard things about it. Did planes really hit the towers or not?.. ehh.. I just don't see how no planes could've hit. I mean, there are all the witnesses in NYC and the plane wreckage.. plus, Idk if it really matters or not if planes hit. Does it really change things. It's always good to question things though. Question everything, thats the only way to find truth.
I agree with both of you. I'm glad there are people out there like us that actually look into things instead of accepting what the TV forces the public to believe. I have my own blog too with info and stuff. Just trying to get info out there. Keep up the fight. Be a leader not a follower!
Peace to both of you!
Good find!
the link to gary at the end is "removed due to terms of service violations" this does look like the same person though... interesting, so this guy is in 9/11 truth too? where?
I wanted to add that Tony Arrigo wouldn't be taking his garbage out at 31 east 12th. It is a building where apartments go for over 2 million dollars and they would put their garbage in the hall in an opening that went down stairs, they would NEVER take it out front. My other post didn't show up, so I'm trying again.
Brayman,
Here's the post that finally pushed me over the edge into "no-planer" land:
http://911logic.blogspot.com/2007/04/earth-is-not-flat.html
Read that and the follow-up links at the bottom and you'll probably find yourself at least thinking that the proposition that no planes hit the towers is not totally nuts. There are some pretty detalied analyses there.
Obviously, believing that there were no planes on 9/11 except for computer-generated images on TV is not the kind of thing that you accept without carefully examining the evidence and thinking about it for a while... skepticism of such a claim is certainly healthy, but give that site a look.
Merry Christmas!
Hey Killtown. Labeling your Statcounter as an indication of how many people think 9/11 was an inside job is a tad misleading.
Grow up.
Just because people end up at your site doesn't mean they believe the shit you spout.
Ladies and Gentlemen:
Tony Arrigo was taking out the Garbage at his place of employment.
MORONS!!!! This was an 78 Yr old man and he called the RADIO STATION!
HE SAW THE ATTACK AND REACTED! YEAH he was born and raised here in NY and didnt have a clue that it wasnt some stupid pilot who just missed his flight path, Like alot of us really felt till we woke up from the shock till the 2nd plane hit. If you REALLY check the facts he saw it and picked up the phone and called the station. Yes he
act and does a good job (you wanna know what he was in email me at chuchgirl@aol.com)
He DID NOT participate in the situation in any way shape or form.
Keep what ever theory you want this was an HONEST New Yorker reacting to a real situation.... get your head out of the clouds
You were there????????
have a great day!
Right Rose...we sure do believe you. Honest New Yorker reacting??? You gotta be kidding. The only one who has there head in clouds in you lady. Crawl back to your NWO hole now please.
New....I was there...I survived it I can claim it as my own and because of that I KNOW...I dont have to prove to you and anyone. I have never seen NY behave better WE BANDED TOGETHER. Tony is my father in law. He did not make it up - after he called the station he called his children to see if we were OK...I made it out of the city and stayed safe. I believe the theories about the goverment anything is possible I still work at WTC. Do you live in NYC??????
All I'm defending is the phone call to the station. Uncle Sam's drone plane well that is different story.
Too many questions in that department.
Just leave the old man alone....he really did have anything to do with the PLOT.
Have a great day.
edit that...to did not..cant type when im angry...its amazing how people pick out something and run with it.
sooooo hey, my name is dan arrigo. this rose character? she's my mom. no, rose is not her real first name. mom is a tad reactionary, i apologize on her behalf for calling you morons, but please understand that she was a little freaked out by all this. with that said, i'd like to speak my mind about this whole ordeal. let's clear this up.
"tony arrigo?" my grandfather. and yes, that IS his real name. shit you not.
you can find tony's acting credits on imdb under his stage name, tony rigo. i think there are two listed, but he's actually both of them. i tried to get imdb to merge the two but they have a policy against that or something.
also, i will be posting his video resume and some home videos on youtube as soon as possible, so that viewers can compare his voice in that to the videos from the news.
i think the thing that perplexes me the most is the type of claims people are making. i would totally understand if someone said that my grandfather, who is indeed an actor (as well as the doorman at the swanky apartments mentioned)was paid to put in a fake claim. this, by the way, is not true, but at least it's somewhat sensical as far conspiracy theories go. but the thing is, there's a number of videos claiming him to be gary welz (whoever that is,) with supposed voice verification technology to "back it up". this isn't just inaccurate, it's just plain silly.
look, i agree that 9/11 was not as simple as the government would have us believe. i think the theories regarding explosions in the lower floors of the building as well as a few (but not all) of the other points mentioned in loose change really do raise some valid questions.
i'm not calling you kooks or nutjobs or anything like that. i think we need people asking questions like this. but i really have to say, tony arrigo is not part of this. other than personal videos of my grandfather that i will upload to youtube ASAP, i have no proof or verifiable facts regarding my grandfather's identity. i'll try to make a video interview with him specificially regarding this matter when he gets back from florida (he's a snowbird, like many seniors.)
while i have no "scientific" proof my grandfather is my grandfather and i can accept the fact that some won't believe me, i just think that those who doubt what the mainstream media says about 9/11 should use the same critical eye on those who support a theory of conspiracy.
a video on youtube purporting to show scientific voiceprint analysis of grandpa's voice does little more than say "THIS IS SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN", choosing to focus on stutters and accents that can and do occur in the voices of many elderly italian new yorkers.
also, on a side note, the video itself is rather irritating, what with the replays that sound like a skipping cd. but that's inconsequential really. i'm just trying to write out what's going on in my head as i read these claims against my grandfather.
as for those who say that his grief is insincere, i have very little to say to you. i mean, there's nothing i can say other than he sounds like that when he's upset about anything, and that people respond to something as traumatic as 9/11 in very different ways. personally, i didn't feel a thing. a strange lack of emotion that bothered me more than the event itself.
at the end of day, nothing i can say here will change your mind if you truly want to believe that my grandfather is part of a conspiracy. it's not the first time genuine witnesses have been called phonies, and i'm sure it won't be the last.
believe me or not, your call. the one thing i hope we can all agree on here is that whoever is reponsible for 9/11 failed miserably at keeping people from speaking their opinions or something. i don't know. two points for freedom. go america, i guess.
i'd like to start a dialogue with anyone who would like to discuss this more. seriously, i find this whole situation incredibly fascinating, so feel free to email me at danisreallycool at gmail dot com.
thanks for your time, sorry for the long post, and keep on rockin' in the free world.
Sincerely,
Daniel Arrigo
Can you guys videotape Tony saying "World Trade Centah" and post it on youtube?
I keep trying to find a picture of Tony Rigo & can't. His profile is all over the internet on movie sites w/what roles he's played though. Interesting that even though his supposed family members claim that it wasn't Gary Welz that it still turns out to be an actor who was the alleged witness. What are the chances of that?
that is a totally valid question, and to be honest, i can't answer it. i have my gut feelings, but we're looking for factual truth here.
my only gripe was suggesting they're the same person. that's all. as for his stuff, i'll put up videos and pictures once he gets back up from florida, and i'll let the folks at killtown know about it.
Please 'Dan' I've been holding back as I don't really have the time for this bullshit....So 'Tony" is "a snowbird, like many seniors.)"..maybe you could tell us why your ** Ahem ** 'Grandfather' goes to Florida for the winter yet comes back to work as a DOORMAN at those "swanky apartments" you speak of in THE SUMMER??
You are full of shit 100% and 'Rose' is full of shit...You are exposed..just as she was...slimk away asshole...I think you are a shill and a bad one at that.
I've thought of a couple of more things to ask ya Dan...
Ok..first thing..since you have confessed that 'Rose' is your 'Mom', and since it is directly related to the topic I quote from 'Rose's' posting on 1-30-07:
"Tony is my father in law. He did not make it up - after he called the station he called his children to see if we were OK"
Huh? Dan, you mean to tell me that 'Tony' called a news station BEFORE "he called his children to see if we were OK"....She gotta be joshin us right Dan? After the horrible, terrible, plane crash he had just observed his first thoughts were to call a new outlet INSTEAD OF HIS FAMILY???? Please Dan, ask 'Rose about this...very disturbing info for you family members I would think to have a grand pappy that thinks about getting on the radio and TV before 'saving' his family.
Dan, also now I'm going to ask for a little clarification.. Since 'Rose' came first, I'm going to guess that she is the one who first discovered this KT blog posting? If I am correct, can you explain exactly how she found out about the specific KT post? If, not 'Rose' that who was in that discovered what is being discussed here? You certainly didn't hear it from mainstream media so what was it that brought you folks here? When I have your reply I will be able to tell you why I have asked.
Now...if I am not mistaken (And maybe I am) doormen in NYC are part of a union. Does Grampa Tony have a union card with his employment as a doorman at the "swanky apartments"? Also, how is Grandpa Tony, the "snowbird" able to take months off this union job as a doorman in "swanky apartments" to fly south to hibernate for the cold winter? Would not "swanky apartments" management frown on such things?
Dan, I have more to ask but I'll leave it at this for now and anxiously await your reply. Remember now Dan, you are the one who stated
"i'd like to start a dialogue with anyone who would like to discuss this more."
Well pal, dialog has started...
the only relatives in manhattan (my mother and father) weren't in that area downtown. he didnt have my mother's work number, and i dont know if he called my dad on his cell or not, probably did though. i'm not sure where my dad was working at the time (it changes) so i wouldn't be surprised if he wasnt downtown either. even if dad was downtown, the family dynamic can be weird at times, but i won't get into it, as it's personal and such, and considering it doesn't change any facts, let's leave that alone. i spoke to grandpa later that night, when he called the whole family. he mentioned he was on the news, and all that, maybe that's what mom was talking about. again, mother isn't the best with communication, especially when confronted with something like this. i hope that clears that point up, lets keep going.
my mother found this site googling 'tony arrigo' to find stuff about his acting career, recently, someone put up a clip of his bit part in the sopranos episode "do not resuscitate," but before that, KT was the first non youtube/video site featuring his name.
as for the union bit, good question to raise, i don't know about the occupational situation there, but i wouldn't be surprised if he has an understanding with his boss, since the tenants like his friendly demeanor.
also dude, since you feel the need to resort to vulgarity, if you've ever met someone whos retired, they might tell you that sometimes people take up small or part time jobs or hobbies to keep themselves active. also, while he does spend the hotter part of the summer sunbathing on my front porch all day, he leaves for florida after the annual christmas party for his job at the swanky building in question, so he works more often when it's not quite cold enough, but getting colder. you've called me all sorts of names, and i don't think it's necessary. i know and support the first amendment, but please, get your facts straight first before you verbally accost someone, i know i did, you douche.
also, to the KT staff, i've edited a clip from his sopranos gig together, it's about 30 seconds if you want to host it, youtube won't let me.
Dan..or is your real name Anthony? Hmmm....anyhow Dan, you must be a shill in training trying to earn your stripes...I gotta say..you ain't doing too well so far. My BS meter is just running to high from your entries....I don't have much time tonight as I have a real job to goto..no paid shilling here..but I will have some more for ya tomorrow. You effectively answered NOTHING in your long winded non reply. My BS meter was through the roof reading it..could even smell it a bit is was so strong.
Your story don't wash pal...and until you can show us all a retrace of the steps Gramps took that day you have zero credibility.
As to being vulgar? Well, you haven't heard a spec of the vulgarities I have for shills, and liars....could fill a book.
KT & Others....I was listening again to The Arrigo call in and I think I caught something. I've never heard it mentioned before so I'm going to throw it out here and see what you folks think. Am I drawing too much into this?
We have all seen the following video for sure:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEDaGnQ0tTA
At 9:35 of this video Tony makes an observation:
"Listen, theres gotta hit at least 7, 8, 15 story's it hadda banged into..Oh and it's HALF WAY IN..IN THE BUILDING"
Huh??? HALF WAY IN? The only video documented of the first shot from the Naudet criminals shows a TOTAL ENTRANCE....Could in NO WAY be mistaken for "HALF WAY IN"..
The BS meter is almost maxed here on this one...what do you folks think?
read everything i've written along with everything else on the internet and tell me where you can prove that tony arrigo is gary welz.
i don't care what his description of the scene is, i don't care if he was paid to put in a fake call, all i'm trying to say is that tony arrigo is not gary welz. prove me wrong. i dare you. i've said an awful lot to respond to a jilty youtube video that shows no evidence other than the words TONY ARRIGO IS GARY WELZ. am i really that crazy here?
even if you believe there is some sort of voiceprint technology with a match, it has never been shown in anything i've seen.
but even if there is this unseen tech, the description in that very video said the match was less than three in 1000. with the population of manhattan (googled at 1,537,195), that still leaves 4,600 people that match, let alone how much the number of people in manhattan increases during the workday. that's not so rare, is it?
tell me where i've ever contradicted myself, tell me where you have irrefutable evidence. tell me anything other than that i'm a shill.
furthermore, and no offense to Killtown, but do you really think the government would pay someone to bother with you for this long? this is strictly personal now.
for god's sake, if i haven't answered your questions, please communicate them better to me, i'll be happy to, just quit acting like i'm the biggest asshole for trying to address your questions and comments.
i know that i'll never change your mind when it comes to judging the honesty of whoever made that phone call, all i'm trying to say is that gary welz and tony arrigo are different people.
provide me with a valid reason why that can't be, and not only will i leave this whole thing alone, i'll check myself into a hospital, because if the person i've thought was my grandfather my whole life doesnt exist, i must be crazy.
and as to the comment made by anthony arrigo on a youtube video, thats my cousin. he lives in california, i live in new york. his youtube name is killercannabis, mine is danisreallycool.
i'm not going to discuss anything about what tony arrigo said or saw or anything until i can at least have you concede that he isn't gary welz. if you can't do that, there's no point talking to you.
also, please, anyone other than this guy, please at least let me know you're reading this and considering what i've said. if i haven't made one person think twice about this whole thing, i'll give up. if this is just an arugment between me and this dude with no one else looking at this, i'll stop right here.
I've noticed that line too, newnight, but never really thought more about it. It's a VERY valid point as it essentially discredits either the eyewitness account or video evidence.
Any other thoughts?
it discredits the witness. again, i'm sure he didn't get a good view, he had a poor time describing the scene (maybe he meant "halfway up the building"), and he's old anyway. there are many people who's frantic, on the spot description is far from accurate. i'm sorry if it seems like i'm monopolizing the comment section, but eyewitness accounts are fallable, and not to be treated as hard fact.
It's possible you're beating a dead horse here, Dan. I know that personally I couldn't care less if Tony=Gary or not. What I care about is the fact that ACTORS, station heads, and network execs spread across the city were simultaneously volunteering eyewitness accounts that seem to be at least provoked and at most entirely scripted. It may not make much difference to you whether or not your grandfather(?) "was paid to put in a fake call," but it certainly does to me. However, that's just my opinion, and to each his own.
Ok....I'm going to try and do this as fast as possible, but you dug yourself such holes yesterday Dan/Anthony that I have to fill them back up..and that takes time.
Well, let's start here.. I asked you a simple question based on the following quote from 'your mom's' posting of 1-30-08. Please, read the following real slow as you apparently did not read it too well the first time around . Here is the quote:
'Rose' 1-30-08: "Tony is my father in law. He did not make it up - after he called the station he called his children to see if we were OK"
There is not ONE BIT of confusion or uncertainty in what 'Rose' wrote. Despite your hollow protest of "mother isn't the best with communication" it is crystal clear that 'Rose' wrote and conveyed exactly what 'she' wanted to. She clearly established that she is married to Tony's Son. She clearly established that she believed Tony based on her first hand knowledge as "after he called the station he called his children to see if we were OK"
That's called certainty in words pal...there is no mistaking what 'Rose' was telling us. YET, instead of answering what I asked you, you ramble on about some "family dynamic" crap. The best you could come up with as an answer is:
"he didnt have my mother's work number, and i dont know if he called my dad on his cell or not, probably did though.
i'm not sure where my dad was working at the time (it changes) so i wouldn't be surprised if he wasnt downtown either"
Can ya see where you went wrong here buddy? Almost laughable I must say.
Ok, though I have another good question about the 'Rose' posting, I'll save that for another time. I'd like to now pick apart the postings you made yesterday.
I asked you another simple question as to how 'Rose' discovered this KT blog. Your very weak, and untruthful reply was:
"my mother found this site googling 'tony arrigo' to find stuff about his acting career"
Lie, lie, lie. Dan, you have got to keep your postings straight. On your VERY FIRST post here on 1-30-08 (One day after 'Rose') you told us:
"you can find tony's acting credits on imdb under his stage name, tony rigo'
So, you will sit there and tell us that 'Rose' googled the name TONY ARRIGO instead of his "STAGE NAME" of Tony RIGO? Also, with a straight face you can tell us that 'Rose' first googled the name TONY ARRIGO on 1-30-08 and NEVER BEFORE???? Lie, lie, lie.
Okay..onto the next lie. Again I quote you from 1-30-08 Dan:
"also, i will be posting his video resume and some home videos on youtube as soon as possible, so that viewers can compare his voice in that to the videos from the news"
Hmmm..where is that video resume? Any home movies yet? Na..I didn't think so. We have all been anxiously waiting for the opportunity to "compare his voice" Dan so what happened?
The best you have come up with as of yesterday is:
"also, to the KT staff, i've edited a clip from his sopranos gig together, it's about 30 seconds if you want to host it, youtube won't let me."
Are you sure you made this 'clip' yourself Dan? Or is it the clip you referred to yesterday when you told us:
"recently, someone put up a clip of his bit part in the sopranos episode "do not resuscitate,"
You have to get your clips straight Dan..observant people can pick these things apart ya know. Also, please tell us why Youtube would not host your video. I'm sure many would be interested to find out why Youtube would be censoring you! It is also strange that Youtube would censor YOU, yet let the "someone" who "put up" the recent clip you mention upload with no censorship? Lie, lie, lie.
Okay..onto the next lie. I brought up some valid questions about Tony's employment as a doorman as you yourself admitted. Your reply to this was very weak:
"i wouldn't be surprised if he has an understanding with his boss, since the tenants like his friendly demeanor."
When I also questioned why "Snowbird" Tony would jet off in the winter only to come back to a hot summer as a doorman, You further stepped in it when you gave a rambling and basically incoherent attempt to explain it away:
"while he does spend the hotter part of the summer sunbathing on my front porch all day, he leaves for florida after the annual christmas party for his job at the swanky building in question,
so he works more often when it's not quite cold enough, but getting colder."
So to sum this up Dan, you have told us that Tony works at the "swanky apartments" from basically October, till mid to late December. You have told us that Tony's 'boss' allows this 3 month out of 12 (Regardless of Union regulations that must be followed) because the "tenants like his friendly demeanor." You have told us that Tony then comes back to spend a restful sunbathing summer before having to return to the doorman job. Nice situation...but a lie, lie, lie.
Last point on Tony's employment. The doormen I see at "swanky apartments" and hotels wear jackets...hats..uniforms. Why was Tony who SHOULD have been in his jacket, hat, uniform, TAKING OUT THE GARBAGE????????? Would garbage removal not fall under the MAINTENANCE or ENGINEERING departments of said establishments??? Can you folks smell what I smell here? Maybe the smell is Tony's doorman uniform after taking out this garbage?
Let's move on. We are almost finished for today. Dan, I was waiting for you to try the approach you tried in one of your posts yesterday. I'm actually suprised it took as long as it did to surface:
"read everything i've written along with everything else on the internet and tell me where you can prove that tony arrigo is gary welz."
This is a common tactic Dan. You are trying to avoid the issue, take some detours and further muddy the already cloudy waters. At this point now, concerning this thread in particular, it matters NONE if "tony arrigo is gary welz". What matters is that you have been trolling YouTube and Blogspot and Lord knows what else to tell us that Tony's call to the station was a legitimate and honest call from a concerned citizen. You have been called on many times now to back this up. You have not backed it up at all. Don't dare now come here and demand proof of anything. Here is further evidence of what game you are playing now:
"i don't care what his description of the scene is, i don't care if he was paid to put in a fake call"
You don't CARE??? Whoa...slow down there. Had YOU done what YOU said YOU would do, this matter might have been laid to rest already. WE CARE about "his description of the
scene". That's what this is all about isn't it? To verify that Tony is on the up and up and was the 'distraught' citizen that made this informative call to NBC. Right? Don't come demanding proofs here pal when you haven't supplied anything you claimed you could...didn't think anyone would call you out on it did ya? As to your VERY REVEALING comment:
"i don't care if he was paid to put in a fake call"
Well...that could sum it all up. Did anyone here ever say the word PAID in direct relation to Tony Arrigo? No, they haven't. This is a classic You said it, I didn't moment for sure. The subconscience coming to the front maybe??
Ok moving on..you said yesterday:
"tell me where i've ever contradicted myself, tell me where you have irrefutable evidence"
I've mentioned a few contradictions Dan..more included in this posting and THATS IRREFUTABLE.
What's also IRREFUTABLE is that something is not right with what you have been telling us. ANY intelligent person can see that.
I may have more to say later..(I haven't even touched on killercannabis yet but thats another laughable lie) but I think I've laid out enough here where its obvious for all to see what is going on and it don't look too pretty for you Dan/Rose/Anthony.
Oh..and BTW..when you produce the actual retracing and full details of Tony's fateful call that sad Tuesday, September 11, 2001 and they verify as true, I will offer you my full apology and I will post this apology at all the sites you troll.
last post, i'll cover these points quickly:
even though i said he called us later that night which is when my mom spoke to him, and no one was around ground zero to be at risk, so it would explain why he called the news first. but, IT DOESNT MATTER who he called, that doesn't prove if he is tony arrigo or gary welz one way or the other. my grandpa could be an asshole that called his family after he called the news. that's possible, so your point isn't a valid counterargument, but that again has nothing to do with his identity.
you don't know my mother, and you don't know how anything about how certain she is about anything, and you don't know how she conveys what she means, so i won't even discuss that. all i meant was that she's not the best with words. example? tony isn't TECHNICALLY her father-in-law, because my parents are divorced. i'm just saying that she's human for christ's sakes, back off.
as for the googling, who says she didnt google both? if she found things googling rigo, is she mandated to stop there? who hasn't googled themselves or their loved ones? i dont know offhand what her webhistory looks like, but i'll say she googled both. now if i looked at her webhistory and confirmed that, how would that make me a liar? it wouldn't.
and yes, i can tell you with a straight face that even if my mom did google his name before 1-30-08, this wouldnt have come up until december 17, 2007, when this KT post was made. that means she could have googled him at the beginning of every month for all it matters. which it doesn't. even if she never googled his name before, that's totally possible. so what?
the clip i mentioned is online is an illegal copy of the entire episode he was on. i misspoke when i said it was just a clip. this is the site: ( http://forum.911movement.org/index.php?showtopic=3289&view=getnewpost ) if you did a little research, you'd see it even asks for a cut up clip with just Tony. that's my clip.
as to why it can't go on youtube, check their policies here: ( http://www.youtube.com/t/howto_copyright ) the clip has parts of the sopranos in it, so i cant upload it. also, the other clip isn't on youtube, it's on some website. do a little research, please.
and i don't have his video resume because tony's in florida, i said that. i'll put it up when i get it.
as for your misunderstanding of the term "snowbird" i point you to the definition of the word. ( http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-us%3AIE-SearchBox&q=define+snowbird ) it's not like an actual snowbird, which perfers colder weather. another oddity of the english language, but nothing that makes me a liar.
to the best of my knowledge, TONY IS NOT IN A UNION. you keep saying lie lie lie, but you haven't done anything to prove i'm lying. what you mean to say is "i don't believe you" but don't say i'm lying, because i'm not, and you can't prove i am.
seriously, you're getting into uniforms? lets say he takes off his jacket, lets say he's careful not to dirty it. arguing over who takes out trash in a building that you've done little to no research on is just silly. you're just talking inconsequentials here.
you've all finally admitted that you don't care if tony is gary or not. that's all i wanted. i understand that nature of these videos is more about the nature of the call over the identity of the caller, but all i care about is that he is acknowledged as a seperate human.
i have and always will say that i believe my grandfather was sincere in his call, but i can't prove that. all i can try to prove is that he's not gary welz. that's all i've ever cared about. and you've admitted that that's a possibility, and thats all i care about. i BELIEVE he isn't part of a conspiracy, but i can't prove it, and i don't care about what you believe. i only care about the fact, and the fact is tony arrigo is not gary welz. the rest of the facts neither of us know. we just don't. we can guess, and that's cool, and we can believe, which is more emotional, but to say we know is too much.
as for my use of the word paid: you keep calling us shills and actors, usually they get paid. thats where i got the word paid from. not that hard to jump to.
feel free to check his imdb and do your own research, and even though i will get back at you with that resume when grandpa comes back, i no longer feel the need to spoon feed you the numerous incidences of my grandfather on screen. rent the dvd, i'm not going to post copyrighted material without permission to satify you. tony arrigo is not gary welz. again, that's all i care about.
i'm done saying tony arrigo is not gary welz, i've done it enough already. seriously though, i will let KT know when i upload his video resume (because he has permission to do so.)
in closing, you can't prove me wrong when i say tony arrigo is not gary welz. your evidence is flimsy at best, and pointing to anything i, my mother, or my cousin have said doesn't change the fact that you have no valid evidence to provide that makes tony arrigo and gary welz the same person. it's youtube hearsay at best. watch the films, shows and commerical listed on his imdb and you'll clearly see that he's not welz. it's nothing you cant find out yourself by doing a little research, but like i said, i'll hit up killtown when i have the material.
the vital things you care about aren't the things i was disputing. you care about what motivated my grandpa to call, concern or conspiracy. i can't say what it was, because i dont know, and you don't either, and neither of us dont have any proof of what we believe to be true, only coincedences and hunches, which on a logical level mean nothing. that's called a stalemate. i was arguing about simply his identity, and it's clear that you can accept that tony arrigo is not gary welz. since you said it matters not. i can see that's the closest thing to an agreement we're going to get here, so i'm going to try my best to never post here again. i make no promises, this identity issue for some reason really makes my blood boil .
that being said, sorry for this Killtown, i know it's childish, but something about this whole thing about saying my grandfather doesnt exist really hits a chord.
ps, london, you're right, i am beating a dead horse, but it's my grandfather's identity here. your non-rabid approach really helped me not go crazy about this whole thing. someone like newnight who is arguing against facts that can easily be verified with the slightest amount of REAL research makes the 9/11 truth community look like a group of fools, and that's a shame. i wouldn't be surprised if HE was the plant here.
"so i'm going to try my best to never post here again. i make no promises, this identity issue for some reason really makes my blood boil"
Boil away pal...LIARS AND SHILLS make mine boil so it's a "stalemate". By all means though, follow through on your statement...don't post here again..as you've been exposed for the liar you are, it's useless for you anyway. You have ZERO credibility here.
"someone like newnight who is arguing against facts that can easily be verified with the slightest amount of REAL research makes the 9/11 truth community look like a group of fools, and that's a shame. i wouldn't be surprised if HE was the plant here."
I can only laugh....you need serious help Dan/Rose/Anthony. That killercannibas isn't doing it for you. Slink away will ya...
Just a comment...I find it interesting that Tony Rigo whose real name is Tony Arrigo is claimed to be the voice on the tape. Google Dan Arrigo and you get some union dude who is attempting to cash in on his 100 hours some week or so after 9/11 cleaning up the pit. So Dan Here you got grandpa calling the news and some guy who claims to have health damage due to the event...interesting. Bet that is either DAD or you....hmmm. so tell me how much do you think you will profit from this scam? Are you/DAD a smoker...Tony sounds like he is...big old scam I bet.
Or Dan are you and killercannibis smoking the wacky weed and now you have F$%@ed up your health and now you wanna pin it all on that measly 100 hrs? Your right New Night they all are a bunch of snakes.
I do have one question to ask in regards to this: let's say that NBC did have foreknowledge of an attack, and as a result put the camera in the building in preparation of getting the shot... why didn't NBC get a shot of the first plane hitting the WTC? All these guys care about is ratings, yet despite having foreknowledge of an attack where they'd be the only network with footage of the first plane, they don't show the footage of this camera where the first plane hits the WTC? Come on, man!
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